[eu-gene] the general

[Philip Galanter]

If you want to consider anything that requires some degree of logical  
thinking to be mathematics, then almost everything man does is  
mathematics because man is always to some degree a rational animal.

What happens then is that the term "mathematics" loses its useful  
meaning.  It just becomes a synonym for "everything we do."

We use informally logical thinking in virtually everything we  
consciously do, but mathematics is different than that.

First, mathematics is formalized.  It has a specific symbolic language  
and rules for making symbolic deductions that are not contingent on  
the particulars of the physical world.

Second, mathematics addresses a rather specific subset of concerns.   
For example, mathematics has nothing to say about moral issues as  
moral issues.

If you intend your sweeping statements to be suggestive metaphors then  
sweep away.  But if you intend them to be literal truths I'd suggest a  
little more in the way of critical thinking.

On Jan 6, 2009, at 9:52 AM, joe dauz wrote:

> Kill the messenger not the thread.
>
> I think the idea that one -art- type be given more weight then  
> another -art- type is the wrong direction to take.
>
> The entire theory of visual art is the 3 assumed classes below
> Dot
> negitve space
> positve space
>
> Very much like
> Bit
> on
> off
>
> I learned this in art books i read as a kid, if math is not art at  
> all then text is not, nor is sound either.
>
> Sound requires logical steps to achieve language and text requires  
> logical steps to chisel, engrave or otherwise create output.
>
> These require direct presumed steps and all have the same ability to  
> be general and/or specific to single grain detail.
>
> Math should be in the humanities more then sciences,but its the base  
> of both.
>
> dauz
>
> On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 12:59 PM, Philip Galanter <list at philipgalanter.com 
> > wrote:
> Joe,
>
> Perhaps you are unaware that the most widely cited definition of  
> generative art is mine.  I'd invite you to read the original paper  
> linked here:
>
> What is Generative Art? Complexity theory as a context for art theory
>
> So I think I have a pretty good handle on the issues involved.
>
> Art and mathematics are different.  Just for a start, mathematics  
> proceeds by using deductive logic.  Art has no such requirement.
>
> Phil
>
> On Jan 5, 2009, at 11:39 AM, joe dauz wrote:
>
>> Art Theory is not  real , please its a oxymoron.
>>
>> This list has defined art (generative not general)several times  
>> over the last year or so of my participation.. look back in the  
>> threads if you dont know what it is.
>>
>> As a near direct representation of a self professed idea,  
>> mathmatics ( 2+2=4 OR ****=4 ) is as much art as anything else is  
>> if you use a pen and paper to draw it. No Theory. Unless you are  
>> saying numbers are text?
>>
>> joe dauz
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 12:12 PM, Philip Galanter <list at philipgalanter.com 
>> > wrote:
>> Assuming you mean to disagree, under what theory of art would  
>> mathematics qualify?
>>
>> On Jan 5, 2009, at 11:02 AM, joe dauz wrote:
>>
>>> HUH, math not a visual art - thats almost funny.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Philip Galanter <list at philipgalanter.com 
>>> > wrote:
>>> http://www.csulb.edu/~karenk/20thcwebsite/439final/ah439fin-Info.00132.html
>>>
>>> Also, an example regarding mathematical proofs isn't terribly  
>>> relevant
>>> to visual art.
>>> --
>>> '"generative" is where you lose control of a machine which does  
>>> exactly
>>> what you tell it.'
>>> To unsubscribe from eu-gene visit
>>> http://www.generative.net/mailman/listinfo/eu-gene
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> '"generative" is where you lose control of a machine which does  
>>> exactly
>>> what you tell it.'
>>> To unsubscribe from eu-gene visit
>>> http://www.generative.net/mailman/listinfo/eu-gene
>>
>>
>> --
>> '"generative" is where you lose control of a machine which does  
>> exactly
>> what you tell it.'
>> To unsubscribe from eu-gene visit
>> http://www.generative.net/mailman/listinfo/eu-gene
>>
>> -- 
>> '"generative" is where you lose control of a machine which does  
>> exactly
>> what you tell it.'
>> To unsubscribe from eu-gene visit
>> http://www.generative.net/mailman/listinfo/eu-gene
>
>
> --
> '"generative" is where you lose control of a machine which does  
> exactly
> what you tell it.'
> To unsubscribe from eu-gene visit
> http://www.generative.net/mailman/listinfo/eu-gene
>
> -- 
> '"generative" is where you lose control of a machine which does  
> exactly
> what you tell it.'
> To unsubscribe from eu-gene visit
> http://www.generative.net/mailman/listinfo/eu-gene

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